Audulus vs Lemur (vs. ditching iPad and learning Max or MFL)?
  • So, I'm coming at this from a little different angle as a use model than i think Audulus is designed for... Maybe...?

    I'm looking to use it as a signal control/logic tool, rather than sound synthesis...

    I'm an synth percussionist, or working out how to do it at least... There's a complete lack of tools to do what I'm looking to do, so I'm going to have to roll all my own stuff I think...

    Now, I know Audulus doesn't have MIDI out right now, but I think it's coming. But from a lot of the vids I've seen and docs I've read, I think Audulus may be what I'm looking for, short of going full PC/Max/PureData (which i don't want to do yet.. I can see a long vertical learning curve in that direction).

    What I mainly need is the ability to build controls/modules to use waves/signals to modify "stuff" in a controlled manner. The trick is being a drummer, knobs, faders, touch, are all out of the picture. So i'm going to need to build things that can increment/decrement "knobs" based on pad hits, velocity, etc.

    So I'd basically use Audulus as a signal control tool for MIDI... So trusting that Aud. will eventually add MIDI I'm willing to buy and learn it if you guys can tell me if it can be made to do the following things:

    * Create a step sequencer that can do step playback.. One note plays per incoming signal (signal=pad hit for instance). Thus I could play an arpeggio or chord progression one note at a time. Obviously it could be fancier by having input signal be generated by an LFO or uLFO triggering a signal at a threshold(s) - Doable in Aud?

    * Create Latch mode type signals... i send a Midi note ON, Aud. holds a MIDI note until it gets the same note ON again, or maybe reaches a gate limit?

    Obviously to really use Aud I'd need MIDI out to trigger drum synths, samples, etc., but again, I'm willing to wait for that while I'm learning Aud. as long as the above pre-requisites are there...

    If they're not, I'd prob. have to move over to Lemur, or maybe drop a bunch of $$$ on a new PC/Live/Max setup (which is where I know I'll end up eventually, but would prefer to do this in smaller steps.. Prototype on an iPad, etc...)

    So, hopefully this makes enough sense to know it's the right direction +/- 90 degrees...

  • This is actually exactly what I plan to use Audulus for, myself, once we have MIDI out. I want to build complex sequencers to control my sample library.

    Check out this sequencer - it was something I made back in 2 - people are already making more complex stuff now:

    Complex stuff like this:

    All I can say is that I tried to learn Max/Pd SEVERAL times and failed really hard. Audulus clicked for me because it works more analogously to electronics than either of those.

    The things you are asking for already exist, built, in Audulus now - check out my Warpeggiator. The things you are asking for are actually *very* simple to make.

    If you narrow it down to a specific purpose driven-module, I can just make it for you and you can look at it and learn how I did what I did.

    Latch is easy - you would just use a timer node that gets pulsed by the gate, the timer would restart, and you have a logic expression that is something like "hold until time is greater than set amount"

    Anyway, just grab a copy of it and dive in - I'm here to help newbies get acquainted, and of course all the lovely people here on the forum will help you as well. Today's n00b is tomorrow's Fractal Patch designer:
  • Here's an example of 2 songs that I made in Audulus + Live, "faking" MIDI out by using Live's extract MIDI functions - these songs were essentially randomly generated. They're the ones called "Hywel Dda" and "Dwynwen"

    From the "Hywel Dda" description: The chugging synth in the background is something I created in Audulus, and it is controlling the sampled guitar and marimba via Live's extract rhythm and melody functions. This song was randomly generated by the sequencer you see pictured (also created in Audulus - this is the Cogito Cartesian sequencer). The random variations in the melody are created from "mistakes" made by Live's melody and rhythm algorithms when scanning the sweeping filter on the synth.
  • @biminiroad: You Said: "All I can say is that I tried to learn Max/Pd SEVERAL times and failed really hard. Audulus clicked for me because it works more analogously to electronics than either of those."

    Considering the stuff I've seen you do with Aud... I think I may as well give up hope on Max! :)

    Just for the sake of planning my life, do we know when MIDI out will be implemented? I'm not going to need anything fancy.. Hell I just need NOTE & CC's...
  • MIDI out is sometime within 3's lifecycle, so in the next year or so - it's a high priority, for sure, and will explode the usefulness of Audulus
  • Hey, I am a little biased, but the projects you've listed (step sequencer, latch playback) are fairly straightforward to put together in Max (and there are lots of user examples of these sorts of applications on the forums and elsewhere). I haven't quite wrapped my head around Audulus yet -- compared to Max, it's feels like it has lot of 'resistance' to quickly slapping modules together. But I don't want to start a religious discussion nor advertise on a competitor's forum. Anyway, drop me a note if I can be of assistance along those lines.
  • @Jeremydb of course what drummonkey is asking for is simple in concept, but all I'm saying is that, in my experience, I've tried to learn Max a bunch of times and it didn't stick. Audulus is more intuitive to people who come from a background of electronics, like myself.

    Also, Max is an order of magnitude more expensive than Audulus, hah!

    As for not wrapping your head around it yet - you will, and it's the same thing as your ability to quickly put a module together in Max. There's nothing that anyone has asked me how to do that I couldn't literally just whip up for them. Audulus isn't simple, but it is simpler, I'd argue. I'd also say that though there is more documentation for Max, there is also more of a necessity to read it, whereas in Audulus, if you are familiar with modular synthesis you can plunge right in no problem.

    That said, there's room enough in the world for both apps, of course! But one thing to consider is that Max will probably never be ported to iOS, nor will Reaktor.
  • @Jeremydb - I love Max and I use it quite a bit with Live. @biminiroad brings up some good points. Audulus is cheaper and its a little easier to understand when you are first starting out. Especially if you have any experience with modular systems. There are only a handful of nodes, they are all pretty straight forward and they all input and output the same thing: signals. Where as Max has hundreds of objects to learn and they all accept different inputs: integers, floating point, lists, signals. I'm not saying its that hard, but it is harder for sure.

    The iOS point is bigger thank you would think at first. Being able to jump from computer to iOS and back on the same patch is really powerful. If I have an idea for a module anywhere, I can get it started on my phone, and it looks and acts just like it does when I get to my computer.

    Also I find my self using it more because its just more fun. Its hard to put my finger on why I find it more fun, but you know how some synths or apps are just fun to mess with. It probably has something to do with how it looks and the fact that it was designed for a touch interface.