Expert Sleepers ES-8: Interfacing Audulus with your Eurorack Modular
  • @robertsyrett @johnson Err whoops! Sorry I got 'em confused - you need that for the Expert Sleepers FH-1, for when Audulus will be able to do MIDI out.
  • @biminiroad You got your eyes in the future!
  • How would I theoretically calibrate an oscillator in audulus?
  • @RobertSyrett You mean autotune an analog oscillator?
  • pretty much.
  • @RobertSyrett - yes, this is possible and something I've been meaning to build. Will test it with my VPO Mankato filter (I don't have an oscillator module, but that should work). Basically the idea is you send a reference voltage out to the oscillator and have it come back in through an ES-8's input, and use a zero cross to check what the pitch is, then use a detector to see if it's lower or higher than the pitch, then use that info to create an offset for the VPO signal that leaves audulus
  • Awesome! If you get a basic patch set up I can test it over on my end with other oscillators. But I'm also wondering, did you forget that disting is also an oscillator?
  • @RobertSyrett - I actually sold my Distings! Holding out for the mk4s and a bigger rack ATM...but most of my money is going into filters/colorful VCAs and more ES-8s honestly since Audulus can be my sequencer/oscillator/envelope thing while I get those nice analog tones :)
  • >more ES-8s
    LOL, how many you gonna end up with?
    I'm with you for the most part, but with only 2 ins and outs I haven't quite cut the cord yet, plus I like analog oscillators. Also there is something to be said in favor of a rig that can be played without a companion computer.
  • @RobertSyrett - I think I'll be happy with 4 - that'll give me 16 in and 24 out! that is, if my poor mac mini can handle that + my apollo at the same time ;)

    And yes, I totally get the non-computer laden modular thing, but I have my computer/interface all in these easy to carry cases that make taking it to a show easy. Also, I use my UAD for finishing effects and backing tracks with Ableton!
  • And here I was thinking I was being ridiculous for thinking about getting two ES-8s!
  • Let me join the chorus of folks who eagerly await the full bevy of IO available on Audulus.

    I love es-8 with Reaktor, but it will be a dream to connect it straight to the ipad with it's multitouch interface, etc
  • @midilifestyle - yes! It's so much fun. We still need to tweak it some more but it's pretty incredible.
  • Gahhh I can't wait!! Eagerly checking this thread / App Store for updates.
    The only other option for multichannel cv via the iPad right now is ZMors modular, which indeed has the full 8 outputs to the es-8*, but I far prefer the Audulus interface/nodes.

    *which, for anyone parsing this thread for connection tips: yes, you can connect the iPad directly to the es-8 using the apple connector that lets you power the iPad and connect USB simultaneously, and yes, you get the full 8 outs and 4 ins that the es-8 offers
  • Sounds awesome!
  • So really, other Silent Way modules sending DC out could also work with this or even DC out's like Motu etc. Correct?

    Also... do we know when there will be midi out modules for Audulus? Then Silent Way FH-1 Fader Host will be great to use as well. Less data intensive and built in 14 bit smoothing if desired.
  • I've been using a MOTU Ultralite with the ADC and DAC nodes, it works well. I had to build some external amps to get it to 10vpp, but otherwise it's good.
  • @biminiroad dooooope
    I was so excited to see the new version hit the App Store. I haven had time to play with it yet, but I'm keen
  • anyway to send midi out from audulus sequencer to the ios app ripplemaker? any work arounds?
  • @Ryancolao midi out is up next but not out yet.
  • I got my ES-8 in today and managed to get some time in with it tonight, I'm pretty impressed! But I'm having a little trouble with Audio In in Audulus, I can't seem to get it to use the ES-8. Even though ES-8 is my system audio device, and I can output signals with no problem, the input keeps using the system microphone. Has anybody else had this issue? I can post more about it tomorrow if nobody else is experiencing this, maybe it's something funny I'm doing.

    But in the meantime, dividing the output from Audulus by 10 gives me a really nice volt per octave control. There's a little unevenness from channel to channel, but it's better than my diy version.

    Does anybody know if the channel to channel variation has been characterized for practical use by anyone?


    Overall my first impressions are that it's a really nice piece of equipment. I'm very pleased with the range, consistency, and mapping of the output voltages.

    Also, of professional interest, they're using an XMOS multicore processor for the brains/aggregator and the only other chip that I took at close look at was their DAC which is a texas instruments PCM 1690:

    XMOS is a great choice for audio devices these days, we used one in the kmix and reaped a lot of benefit from their class compliant audio device code (which is well supported by apple and works great with iOS). How's the ES-8 Windows driver, has anybody used it?

    Plus XMOS is a Bristol based fabless design house - I noticed that Expert Sleepers proudly announced on the packaging that they were manufacturing their products in England. It's very neat that they're able to support both in-country manufacturing and a give a big part of their BOM cost to a uk chip company, their pride in these things is well deserved.

    Now that I have the ES-8 and am enjoying it, I'm kind of excited to add on their other support boards. Or do people recommend just buying more ES-8s?
  • @demcanulty I got a second es-8 and a couple of light pipes and it works really well. I think the only benefit from getting the other support boards would be additional inputs, but candidly 8 is typically sufficient for multitrack recording or cv input. Also with 2 ES-8 modules I can have one hooked up to Audulus on the iPad and the other to Ableton. Currently I am playing my Audulus oscillators is with CV out from the Expert Sleepers Silent Way Synth Voice plug-in.
  • I found my issue, I had another device overriding my input device settings, so I had to explicitly set the ES-8 to be my input, not just my system audio device.

    I guess I need to figure out how to get access to the rest of the 8 analog inputs on my ES-8, I was thinking 4 was overly limiting. 8 would be great.
  • Does your MOTU have ADAT i/o?
  • No, just S/PDIF. On the bright side I've got 6 AC coupled inputs that I've broken out from the motu, so having the 4 DC coupled inputs in addition is a big step up. I think I'll put more research into this tonight, finally have a bit of time for a change. :)
  • I think I finally understand everything about the device, or almost everything. I was able to successfully design an aggregate input device using Rogue Amoeba's Loopback, but there's no good way that I can currently find to make aggregate output devices that mix and match the channels the way I need to. I've got a mail out to Rogue Amoeba to see if they have any suggestions. If they do, then I might be all set going that route and able to use all my i/o as conveniently as I'd like.
  • @midilifestyle - there's a topic on this over here:

    In the future with the data node or perhaps more custom made stuff, you'll be able to do more accurate auto-tuning self-scaling stuff.

    The V/Oct translation from Audulus to real world is complicated by the DC Audio interfaces themselves - doesn't have much to do really with the math itself, just the voltage range of the interfaces not being perfect. More exploration of this will need to take place for sure :)
  • After much delay I finally got a night to just sit with the my expert sleepers stuff and independently control all my oscillators while keeping them in tune. It's sooo great. The es3 and the es6 are really nice additions to the ES-8. Gives me a 10-in, 16-out physical interface.

    3000 x 2250 - 2M
  • The set-up is looking pretty sweet!
  • Thanks! I kind of over purchased in a frenzy of accumulation and of course midway through life exploded and I also started getting back into guitar. But I'm pretty pleased with it, and am really enjoying it when I'm working with it. I'm looking forward to my next creative burst with it. I think I have more than enough stuff now to make the kinds of music I'd like to without feeling any constraints other than my own creative energy and focus (always a tough pair to wrangle and keep controlled in any endeavor).
  • "I think I have more than enough stuff now to make the kinds of music I'd like to without feeling any constraints other than my own creative energy and focus (always a tough pair to wrangle and keep controlled in any endeavor)."

    Amen to that! If only I knew what made me ticked, I would be king of the world.
  • I heard someone speculate once that the most successful people in the world may owe their success as much to the constructive interference of their own mix of neuroses as many of us owe our least productive habits to the destructive interference of our own neuroses. I've always thought that was an interesting way to think about it. Sort of hard to prove or disprove, so not very scientific, but it does explain how some people just seem to be able to work constantly. Makes me think that if all of my bad habits ganged up and worked together for good for a change, they'd be unstoppable! :)
  • @RobertSyrett - I just got my Doepfer uPVCO and I was wondering there was some topic where you described a workaround for the tuning? How do you match the octave standard in Audulus to 1vpo? I know you were saying (o+4)/10 doesn't work
  • That's for cv input. Cv output should just be (o+octave)/10. The only tip I would add is to output a reference tone so you have something to tune to.
  • Checking in briefly, I've been sucked into guitar but my synths are beginning to call to me. Hope you guys are doing well, I've missed posting here! :)
  • @demcanulty Good to hear from you! I've been sucked into the world of painting, but I'm taking a week off while I house sit in SF to make modular music. My friend actually lent me a MakeNoise Shared System(!) so I'm pretty stoked to see what Audulus can do with that guy attached.
  • hey all, new here and wanted to say this is a great forum. lots of amazing work being done here!

    I have a eurorack system and an ipad, looking into the ES-8 for interfacing the two. I have a couple noob questions if that's ok...

    How do you download the ES-8 module into Audulus? Will it pull it up once the two are connected? related: how do you download patches/modules that other users have created? the eurorack reproductions are incredibly enticing.

    On the ES-8, can you theorectically assign whatever you'd like to whatever output you'd like? Could you have, for instance, sequencer cv/gate on outputs 1&2, separate LFO's on 3-5, random gates 6-8? or 8 S&H's? etc...

    Thanks for your help!
  • @shred - Glad you're getting on board with this! First, check out this guide I posted over at ATS:

    Your questions:

    "How do you download the ES-8 module into Audulus?"

    The ES-8 is an audio interface, so you don't have to download anything into Audulus per se. What you do use is the ADC-DAC (analog-to-digital/digital-to-analog) converter nodes that allow you to access the inputs and ouputs of the ES-8. The inputs from the ES-8 come in through ADC channels 1-4, and the outputs of the ES-8 come from DAC channels 1-8.

    "Will it pull it up once the two are connected?"

    No, you have to load the ADC/DAC nodes separately, or you have to open one of the many ES-8 specific modules. However, the iPad will automatically recognize the device as the audio input and will by default use input 1 for its "mic" input, and outputs 1&2 for left and right (that is, for other apps).

    "related: how do you download patches/modules that other users have created? the eurorack reproductions are incredibly enticing."

    Refer to this video:

    "On the ES-8, can you theorectically assign whatever you'd like to whatever output you'd like? Could you have, for instance, sequencer cv/gate on outputs 1&2, separate LFO's on 3-5, random gates 6-8? or 8 S&H's? etc..."

    YES absolutely! Describe your dream ES-8 module and we'll help you build it.

    Also, refer to this post:
  • @shred also this is the forum patch collection - it has instructions inside it how to transfer patches to your iOS device:
  • @biminiroad Thank you so much! that confirms most of my understanding so far, I've been reading and watching lots of tutorial vids and posts. But it's great to know I'm on the right track.

    The downloading process is much easier than I expected it to be!

    Keeping my eyes peeled now for that next batch of ES-8's to land.

    I don't even know what my dream ES-8 module would be! lol
    The way I'm thinking of approaching it is like a preset patch storage for control voltages for the eurorack. Something where I can have separate modules/patches to pull up on command.
  • @shred - thanks, and that's an excellent use of the ES-8! I basically use mine mostly as a sequencer/envelope source, there's so much you can do with it. It's basically like a DIY module that's infinitely variable in an instant!
  • finally downloaded a bunch of patches last night including a lot of the uModular collection... I really like the ES-8 modules in there. Does one of them have attenuators on all of the outputs? I'm still learning the symbols, figuring it out as I go.

    And with all of the lfo options and the Rungler being worked on I'm just drooling over the possibilities!

    Something like Intellijel's Dr. Octacture with it's 8 lfo's all phase shifted would be fun. Or the Harvestman's Zorlon Cannon which he describes as a "Dual Linear Feedback Shift Register Battery"
  • @shred - the one with what looks like an envelope and a sine wave going through it is a linear attenuator, and the one with speakers is an audio attenuator. It's in the response of the attenuators.

    There already is an octature LFO ES-8 module with which you can adjust the phase of the envelopes and all that goodness - it's here:

  • woah, rad! totally forgot to look through that thread! thanks so much
  • @shred that's awesome! sounds great - full on R2D2 :) Don't you love those ES-8 flashy flashies?

  • Love them flashin' lights! Cool sounds.
  • @biminiroad @stschoen thanks!! had a blast with this patch... had some great laser sounds going after I stopped recording.

    All sound and modulation is coming from Audulus into the uVCF and then to the mixer, but I'm only really using one saw and one random lfo. the rest of the blinky lights are just for fun :)